🚀 go-pugleaf

jarrodhroberson@yahoo.com (Y2KYZFR1) graced us with the following:

>It explains a study about "intentional blindness".

It was an interesting article.  I think the translation of the study to
motorcycles was a little bit of a stretch though.  We aren't any more
unexpected around town than a bicycle or a pedestrian.  In a hectic highway
situation it makes perfect sense.

--
___________________________________________

    Mich�l Tr��tm�n
	http://www.troutman.org/vfr
	http://www.zen-data.com

This is why I often say "Gorilla comes out of fucking nowhere!"

The thing is, people can't recall that I said it.


--
"A common mistake that people make when trying to design something
completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete
fools." -Douglas Adams

Alex Westley, aka Kragma

    Gee, makes me wonder why motorcycles are required to run their
headlights during the day.  Wasn't it to be more noticable than the rest of
traffic???  Then why did they start having ALL vehicles run their headlights
during the day?
    Once everyone became accustomed to seeing headlights all day long,
motorcycles and emergency equipment were put at serious risk.
    Here's a novel solution, how about we train drivers to be observant, and
make sure they are responsible enough to drive, rather than the "K-mart
special" licenses they hand out now?

    As long as people rely on technology to overcome their own laziness,
accidents WILL happen.


    Michael


"Y2KYZFR1" <jarrodhroberson@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:c718a6cf.0108170952.106bdb93@posting.google.com...
> Be sure and read the gorilla article in this months American
> Motorcyclist, you are an AMA member right? If not, get a friend to
> loan your copy.
>
> It explains a study about "intentional blindness".
>
> The study had two teams of 3 people each passing an ordinary
> basketball around.
> Viewer of the video tape were asked to count various things like
> number of bounch passes vs number of in air passes, etc.
>
> They put a woman in a gorilla suit walking thru the scene, guess how
> many people claimed they "never say the gorilla?", guess how many
> wanted to see the video tape as proof and did not believe the gorilla
> was there in the first place? It is not that cagers are inattentive,
> they are
>
> Lots of other studies and an explaination of what the ramification and
> mechanisms at work that enable this behavior.
>
> Makes that kisan headlight modulator that much more important because
> it triggers a "danger"/cop/ambulance instinct that all cagers are
> trained to look for and NOT ignore.
>
> Get it today . . .

mik?tr?tm?.org (Tr?tm?) wrote in message news:<Xns91009C0C8823F13642078419987@209.249.185.71>...
> jarrodhroberson@yahoo.com (Y2KYZFR1) graced us with the following:
>
> >It explains a study about "intentional blindness".
>
> It was an interesting article.  I think the translation of the study to
> motorcycles was a little bit of a stretch though.  We aren't any more
> unexpected around town than a bicycle or a pedestrian.  In a hectic highway
> situation it makes perfect sense.

yeah and the cagers run down bicycist and peds every day also.

For a while down in Buckhead in Atlanta at LEAST 2 people were run
over and killed every week one year. Of course in almost EVERY
incident the peds were jaywalking or crossing illegally and stupidly
but matter of fact is, in every case I saw in the paper or on the news
the driver either said or was quoted as saying "I never saw them"!
Mainly because they were not looking for them.

"Michael" <noc108@SPAMMUSTDIEfrontiernet.net> wrote in message news:<9llrgo$3sfs$1@node21.cwnet.roc.gblx.net>...
> Gee, makes me wonder why motorcycles are required to run their
> headlights during the day.  Wasn't it to be more noticable than the rest of
> traffic???  Then why did they start having ALL vehicles run their headlights
> during the day?
>     Once everyone became accustomed to seeing headlights all day long,
> motorcycles and emergency equipment were put at serious risk.
>     Here's a novel solution, how about we train drivers to be observant, and
> make sure they are responsible enough to drive, rather than the "K-mart
> special" licenses they hand out now?
>

Well that will never happen in the entitlement society we live in.

My only recourse was the modulator, and I can attest that it has saved
me having to avoid at least 6 "incidents" since March 01, and probably
more I am not aware off. Just one cager double takes and stops is
worth it, this thing has paid for it self 100X over already.

Alex Westley <an.otaku@verizon.nospam.net> wrote:

>This is why I often say "Gorilla comes out of fucking nowhere!"
>
>The thing is, people can't recall that I said it.

Said what?

-Big Bob
"Old Hondas never die, they just get slower, and slower, whilst they lose
compression and devour great quantities of oil." Motorcycle World, June 1971

Put a hot woman in a bikini and I bet every man would say basketball?...what
basketball.
Guess how many wanted to see the video tape again and never saw the
basketball the second time either?  LOL


"Y2KYZFR1" <jarrodhroberson@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:c718a6cf.0108170952.106bdb93@posting.google.com...
> Be sure and read the gorilla article in this months American
> Motorcyclist, you are an AMA member right? If not, get a friend to
> loan your copy.
>
> It explains a study about "intentional blindness".
>
> The study had two teams of 3 people each passing an ordinary
> basketball around.
> Viewer of the video tape were asked to count various things like
> number of bounch passes vs number of in air passes, etc.
>
> They put a woman in a gorilla suit walking thru the scene, guess how
> many people claimed they "never say the gorilla?", guess how many
> wanted to see the video tape as proof and did not believe the gorilla
> was there in the first place? It is not that cagers are inattentive,
> they are
>
> Lots of other studies and an explaination of what the ramification and
> mechanisms at work that enable this behavior.
>
> Makes that kisan headlight modulator that much more important because
> it triggers a "danger"/cop/ambulance instinct that all cagers are
> trained to look for and NOT ignore.
>
> Get it today . . .

Can you believe what Y2KYZFR1 said!?
>
>Be sure and read the gorilla article in this months American
>Motorcyclist, you are an AMA member right? If not, get a friend to
>loan your copy.
>
>It explains a study about "intentional blindness".
>
>The study had two teams of 3 people each passing an ordinary
>basketball around.
>Viewer of the video tape were asked to count various things like
>number of bounch passes vs number of in air passes, etc.
>
>They put a woman in a gorilla suit walking thru the scene, guess how
>many people claimed they "never say the gorilla?", guess how many
>wanted to see the video tape as proof and did not believe the gorilla
>was there in the first place? It is not that cagers are inattentive,
>they are
>
>Lots of other studies and an explaination of what the ramification and
>mechanisms at work that enable this behavior.
>
>Makes that kisan headlight modulator that much more important because
>it triggers a "danger"/cop/ambulance instinct that all cagers are
>trained to look for and NOT ignore.
>
>Get it today . . .

Nice article from what you describe..."BUT" their conclusions are all wrong. A
more accurate answer for both the people in the study and using the conclusions
drawn from it for motorists seeing motorcycles, bicycles and pedestrians would
be that "it's somebody else's problem" motorists look at motorcycles etc. as
"not my problem" therefore ignore it and concentrate on their immeadiate goals.

Keith---I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the
morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day.  Sinatra

"Y2KYZFR1" <jarrodhroberson@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:c718a6cf.0108170952.106bdb93@posting.google.com...
> Makes that kisan headlight modulator that much more important
because
> it triggers a "danger"/cop/ambulance instinct that all cagers are
> trained to look for and NOT ignore.
> Get it today . . .

I am considering getting the modulator.  It sounds like a very good
idea.  It was very coincidental that one of the guys that went on the
ride with us last night was telling of a friend of his who recently
got a ticket (I don't remember where he said it was) for using his.
The ticket was for "excessive use of lights".  He said the judge stood
behind the cop and he wound up having to pay it.  I'll have to find
out where the chicken-shit town was, and get a name and phone number
to verify it, but thought it was interesting.  Still, anything that
helps keep me alive has to be worth it, especially with the number of
miles I clock.  Is is easily to install?
--
Maggie
'01 Vulcan 800 Classic
'00 Vulcan 1500 Classic
'75 Yamaha Enduro 250
100cc Suzuki Mutt (built from several bikes)
250cc Yamaha Mutt

"Margaret Modisette" <smodisette@houston.rr.com> typed with fingers ablaze
<Rqzf7.133832$g_3.20954794@typhoon.austin.rr.com>:

>The ticket was for "excessive use of lights".  He said the judge stood
>behind the cop and he wound up having to pay it.  I'll have to find
>out where the chicken-shit town was, and get a name and phone number
>to verify it, but thought it was interesting.  Still, anything that
>helps keep me alive has to be worth it, especially with the number of
>miles I clock.  Is is easily to install?

I've got a couple of 2" 50 watt halogen spots on my bike. I figure I'll get
a ticket for them eventually. But I rode by a police station every day and
no one hassled me.

I believe at the very least they reduced the incident of close left turns
in front of me to near zero, and drivers notice me a lot more on our SoCal
freeways. Even in daylight. At night, I can actually see the road even with
all those SUVs and trucks moving in the opposing direction, when I'm in the
left lane.

Considering how expensive an accident can be, not to mention the pain and
recouperation, an infrequent ticket wouldn't be too high a price to pay for
that. I fear again hitting another 15" wheel at 70 mph, dropped off a
pickup truck with its tailgate down a lot more than a fixit ticket. Hitting
that wheel in the road at night cost me $300 to replace the rim, tire and
re-lace. I was lucky to be alive afterward. The 2" 50 watt spots got put on
the next week.

While a headlight modulator might help you get seen by drivers, more light
will help you get seen and make night riding safer.

JMO.

--
 ~---(_)
   (O/        Steph "The Mad Scientist" Greenberg     BS#30
   )/         "No, We Do Not Rent Pigs"
  (_)

"Margaret Modisette" <smodisette@houston.rr.com> wrote in message news:<Rqzf7.133832$g_3.20954794@typhoon.austin.rr.com>...
> "Y2KYZFR1" <jarrodhroberson@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:c718a6cf.0108170952.106bdb93@posting.google.com...
> > Makes that kisan headlight modulator that much more important
>  because
> > it triggers a "danger"/cop/ambulance instinct that all cagers are
> > trained to look for and NOT ignore.
> > Get it today . . .
>
> I am considering getting the modulator.  It sounds like a very good
> idea.  It was very coincidental that one of the guys that went on the
> ride with us last night was telling of a friend of his who recently
> got a ticket (I don't remember where he said it was) for using his.
> The ticket was for "excessive use of lights".  He said the judge stood
> behind the cop and he wound up having to pay it.  I'll have to find
> out where the chicken-shit town was, and get a name and phone number
> to verify it, but thought it was interesting.  Still, anything that
> helps keep me alive has to be worth it, especially with the number of
> miles I clock.  Is is easily to install?


This is a bunch of bullshit because they are legal in all fifty states
as mandated by FEDERAL LAW. It sounds more like something someone who
thinks they are stupid for sissy's or can't afford them would say.

All you have to do is search the net for headhight modulator
motorcycle and you will find links to the federal statuate that makes
them legal in all 50. And local municipalities can not override
federal codes like that, it is explained in the code.

Y2KYZFR1 wrote:
>
> Local municipalities can not override federal codes like that, it is explained in the code.

A local judge can do pretty much whatever he feels like doing, and there
is frequently nothing you can do about it.
Illegal? Yes. Immoral? Yes. But that's the way the system works.

P.

Peter Roehling <peter_roehling@eee.org> wrote in message news:<3B80A6C2.B743257E@eee.org>...
> Y2KYZFR1 wrote:
> >
> > Local municipalities can not override federal codes like that, it is explained in the code.
>
> A local judge can do pretty much whatever he feels like doing, and there
> is frequently nothing you can do about it.
> Illegal? Yes. Immoral? Yes. But that's the way the system works.
>
> P.

not in the US they can't.

Peter Roehling <peter_roehling@eee.org> wrote in message
news:3B80A6C2.B743257E@eee.org...
> Y2KYZFR1 wrote:
> >
> > Local municipalities can not override federal codes like that, it is
explained in the code.
>
> A local judge can do pretty much whatever he feels like doing, and there
> is frequently nothing you can do about it.
> Illegal? Yes. Immoral? Yes. But that's the way the system works.
>
> P.

Well...... not always.  If Federal Law preempts the local law under
Supremacy rights, then given proper citations to the right authorities will
cause a Judge to deprive himself of jurisdiction.  But this is incredibly
rare.   And maybe I'm a bit Pollyanna-ish about this, but I've appeared in
courthouses in most of the counties in California, and in a variety of
federal courts in a few different states in the past 25 years, and most of
the Judges have been incredibly conscientious about following the law (Stare
Decisis) and doing the right thing.   I'm lucky enough to have a couple of
published appellate decisions, and in those cases the Judges from the trial
courts were upheld.   This doesn't happen if the Judges are doing anything
they want.   Consider that historically, until recently, Judges were paid
poorly, and could generally make twice as much money by staying in private
practice.   They mostly took the bench to engage in public service.   Are
there bad or immoral judges?   Sure there are.....  I've run into a few.
But by and large the failings of the legal system do not originate with the
Judges.  IMHO.

Which is not to say that there aren't major problems with our legal system.
There are.  But don't get me started.  Let's go back to motorcycles.

Larry
01 929 CBR RR

Y2KYZFR1 wrote:
>
> Peter Roehling <peter_roehling@eee.org> wrote in message news:<3B80A6C2.B743257E@eee.org>...
> > Y2KYZFR1 wrote:
> > >
> > > Local municipalities can not override federal codes like that, it is explained in the code.
> >
> > A local judge can do pretty much whatever he feels like doing, and there
> > is frequently nothing you can do about it.
> > Illegal? Yes. Immoral? Yes. But that's the way the system works.
> >
> > P.
>
> not in the US they can't.

Dream on. Despite Larry's somewhat Pollyanna-ish attitude towards the
law (understandable since he's an attorney) my experience has been that
unless you feel like dumping thousands of dollars into lawyer's fees you
don't stand a chance on something like this.

So while in theory you might have slightly better than a snowball's
chance in Hell of overturning a bad traffic court decision, in fact
nobody in their right mind is going to bother on something like an
equipment violation.

P.

"Larry for Real Estate" <liw@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:5F3g7.24242$1p1.1880663@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
>
>
> Which is not to say that there aren't major problems with our legal
system.
> There are.  But don't get me started.  Let's go back to motorcycles.


Well, I guess we could talk about the legal system and lawyers all day and
night long and then some.

But I found the following below on a web site from Signal Dynamics at
www.signaldynamics.com (no, I am not connected in any way with this company,
I stumbled across it during a search for light modulators):

Mr. Walter T. Jakobowski
President
Signal Dynamics Corporation
PO Box 350441
Ft. Lauderdale, FL 33335


Dear Mr. Jakobowski:

This is in reply to your letter of July 28, 1997 asking for an
interpretation regarding the preemptive effect of Federal Motor Vehicle
Safety Standard No.108.

Your company manufactures motorcycle headlamp modulators "that comply with
standard No. 108." You report receiving comments that certain States do not
allow use of this equipment. You ask for "an interpretation and a copy of
the statutes that provide for Federal Law pre-empting any state laws that
would disallow use of said Headlight Modulator."

Section 30103 (b) of Title 49, United States Code, provides in pertinent
part that:

b PREEMPTION - (1) When a motor vehicle safety standard is in effect under
this chapter, a State or a political subdivision of a State may prescribe or
continue in effect a standard applicable to the same aspect of performance
of a motor vehicle or motor vehicle equipment only if the standard is
identical to the standard prescribed under this chapter.

Paragraph s7.9.4 Motorcycle headlamp modulation (formerly s5.6) of Standard
No. 108 specifies that a headlamp on a motorcycle may be wired to modulate,
provided that it does so in accordance with the requirements prescribed by
that paragraph. Under 49 U.S.C. 30103 (b) (1), a state may have its own
standard which allows a motorcycle headlamp to be wired to modulate in the
same manner as prescribed under s7.9.4. However, since the Federal standard
specifically allows a modulation of motorcycle headlamps, a State cannot
have a standard prohibiting it. For your information, we are not aware of
any State that forbids modulation of motorcycle headlamps.

Taylar Vinson provided you with a copy of 49 U.S.C. 30103 (b) on your visit
to our Office on July 28. If you have further questions, you may reach him
at 202-366-3820.

Sincerely,

John Womack
Acting Chief Counsel

>This is a bunch of bullshit because they are legal in all fifty states
>as mandated by FEDERAL LAW.

http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/get-cfr.cgi?TITLEI&PARTW1&SECTION8&YEAR 00&TYPE=TEXT

I wanted verification, and/or I have nothing better to do.  You
decide.

Steve


1999 Bandit 1200S
1975 CB400F

Pius Frei <pfrei@home.com> wrote in message
news:Uejg7.298746$qc.35606893@news1.rdc1.va.home.com...

> Well, I guess we could talk about the legal system and lawyers all day and
> night long and then some.

Yeah, we could, but after practicing for 25 years, I'd rather talk about
motorcycles.  Lots more interesting IMHO.
>
> But I found the following below on a web site from Signal Dynamics at
> www.signaldynamics.com (no, I am not connected in any way with this
company,
> I stumbled across it during a search for light modulators):
>
> Mr. Walter T. Jakobowski
> President
> Signal Dynamics Corporation
> PO Box 350441
> Ft. Lauderdale, FL 33335
>
>
> Dear Mr. Jakobowski:
>
> This is in reply to your letter of July 28, 1997 asking for an
> interpretation regarding the preemptive effect of Federal Motor Vehicle
> Safety Standard No.108.
>
> Your company manufactures motorcycle headlamp modulators "that comply with
> standard No. 108." You report receiving comments that certain States do
not
> allow use of this equipment. You ask for "an interpretation and a copy of
> the statutes that provide for Federal Law pre-empting any state laws that
> would disallow use of said Headlight Modulator."
>
> Section 30103 (b) of Title 49, United States Code, provides in pertinent
> part that:
>
> b PREEMPTION - (1) When a motor vehicle safety standard is in effect under
> this chapter, a State or a political subdivision of a State may prescribe
or
> continue in effect a standard applicable to the same aspect of performance
> of a motor vehicle or motor vehicle equipment only if the standard is
> identical to the standard prescribed under this chapter.
>
> Paragraph s7.9.4 Motorcycle headlamp modulation (formerly s5.6) of
Standard
> No. 108 specifies that a headlamp on a motorcycle may be wired to
modulate,
> provided that it does so in accordance with the requirements prescribed by
> that paragraph. Under 49 U.S.C. 30103 (b) (1), a state may have its own
> standard which allows a motorcycle headlamp to be wired to modulate in the
> same manner as prescribed under s7.9.4. However, since the Federal
standard
> specifically allows a modulation of motorcycle headlamps, a State cannot
> have a standard prohibiting it. For your information, we are not aware of
> any State that forbids modulation of motorcycle headlamps.
>
> Taylar Vinson provided you with a copy of 49 U.S.C. 30103 (b) on your
visit
> to our Office on July 28. If you have further questions, you may reach him
> at 202-366-3820.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> John Womack
> Acting Chief Counsel

Which tracks my comments about Federal Preemption, if you followed my last
posting.  If the Acting Chief Counsel is correct, then this is one of those
rare times when a Judge would recuse himself for lack of jurisdiction over a
federally preempted field.     If someone is putting modulated lights on
their motorcyles, it wouldn't be a bad idea for them to print out attorney
Womack's opinion letter, and keep a copy under his/her seat.   Not every
LEO, or local Judge will immediately recognized this as a preempted field.
I didn't, even though I brought up the concept.   This is a pretty
specialized area that doesn't come up often at the motor vehicle equipment
level.

Larry
01 929 CBR RR
>
>

"Larry for Real Estate" <liw@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message news:<%8mg7.18704$Ki1.1489931@bgtnsc06-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>...

>
> Which tracks my comments about Federal Preemption, if you followed my last
> posting.  If the Acting Chief Counsel is correct, then this is one of those
> rare times when a Judge would recuse himself for lack of jurisdiction over a
> federally preempted field.     If someone is putting modulated lights on
> their motorcyles, it wouldn't be a bad idea for them to print out attorney
> Womack's opinion letter, and keep a copy under his/her seat.   Not every
> LEO, or local Judge will immediately recognized this as a preempted field.
> I didn't, even though I brought up the concept.   This is a pretty
> specialized area that doesn't come up often at the motor vehicle equipment
> level.
>
> Larry
> 01 929 CBR RR


Kisan puts a photocopy of the statute in will all their modulators.